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77 bay steering and wander... Running out of options.....

Discussion in 'Bay Tech Clinic' started by Chidori, Aug 28, 2012.

  1. syncro

    syncro Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    9,196
    Location:
    Southern Highlands
    Otherwise you are just wasting your time.

    It's not rocket science. Just find someone that is not a halfwit and he will fix it.
     
    1500king likes this.
  2. cbus

    cbus Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    11,428
    Location:
    sunshine coast
    Totally agree with Barry and Phill.

    Do it in sequence.
    Read up ratwell
    http://www.ratwell.com/technical/SwayBars.html

    Start with checking tyres, tyre pressures, all parts and bushes good, bearings, proper 4 wheel alignment.
     
    1500king likes this.
  3. TeeBee

    TeeBee Active Member

    Messages:
    133
    Location:
    Outer East Melbourne
    I've checked most of those things and the apparent 'non-halfwit' has told me there's nothing wrong and there's nothing to fix. Next on my list is a 4 wheel alignment, check suspension and then, if no luck, I'll be looking at sway bars. I've already read the Ratwell piece on sway bars and that's why I thought they sounded good. :)
     
    Chidori likes this.
  4. tintop

    tintop Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    361
    Location:
    Canberra
    yeah, after I've done everything to bring them back to normal (for a kombi), then I put KYB gas shock absorbers on, a heavy duty front anti-sway bar and a rear anti-sway bar on....good on the windy roads but if you are going off road, it's much easier to lift a wheel and have it spin.
     
    David H, syncro and TeeBee like this.
  5. Barry

    Barry Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,271
    Location:
    Abbotsford NSW
    A mate had handling issues in his bay.
    He is very knowledgeable in VW’s.
    Took years to find that one of the rear trailing arms were bent.
    Been slammed into a gutter we guessed.
    Anyway he replaced it and was still having trouble.
    Went back and started again.
    Turned out the replacement trailing arm was also bent.

    Point is - these babies are getting older and there are lots of things that can affect handling.
    Getting good replacement bits is also getting hard
     
    Chidori and KahunaKombi like this.
  6. Chidori

    Chidori Active Member

    Messages:
    918
    Location:
    Fitzroy, VIC

    I think these 16 pages prove that it's not always that simple. I've lost count of the amount of people I have paid and not paid to look at my steering and suspension issues.
    I have spent thousands of $, posted videos, written essays, been underneath about 100 times, replaced everything possible in the front end and some in the back, replaced the steering box 4 times and it's still not fixed.
     
  7. Barry

    Barry Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,271
    Location:
    Abbotsford NSW
    You know one day you find that there is some minor nut that is not done up right.

    Some random bloke will say “why don’t you do that up properly. You do know it will cause issues with your handling”
     
    Chidori likes this.
  8. Mellow Yellow 74

    Mellow Yellow 74 Active Member

    Messages:
    827
    Location:
    Sydney
    Doesn’t a factory front sway bar provide stock performance?
     
  9. cbus

    cbus Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    11,428
    Location:
    sunshine coast
    Have said it elsewhere but having had a 71 that handled VERY well in windy hilly roads where I lived at the time which did not have any sway bar upgrades but slightly low profile tyres and VERY heavy oil shocks , I continue to make the case for heavy shocks and good tyres.
    I used to rally just prior to buying that kombi and also drove the girlfriends LS mini so was used to controlled handling but was also happy with the van in any circumstance other than its lack if power.
    The shocks were so stiff that they limited compliant movement of the wheels so in that regard did act similar to sway bars in restricting independent wheel movement :D

    Point is... there's lots of margin available in shocks and balance to address the usual complaints.
    Enough to create a stable van.
     
    Chidori and TeeBee like this.
  10. Barry

    Barry Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,271
    Location:
    Abbotsford NSW
    Yes - but the jist I was getting at is doing changes by adding additional parts to get standard performance is heading down the wrong track.
    If standard parts are missing then it is wise to add them back first
     
    cbus and Grantus like this.
  11. KahunaKombi

    KahunaKombi Super Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    19,331
    Location:
    Bracken Ridge, Qld
    Am siding with Barry in his last few posts.

    I was forced off the road one night @ Seven Hills NSW near the rail station in another marque and hit a bollard wiping out LHS front :mad: - put into a mate I trusted who ran panel & spray shop - he had hells own trouble getting the steering right and alignment just wasn't happening :( then realised the impact with the bollard had spun aligning parts 180 degrees in the front end and when he replaced and set the same as the right all was good :D

    So there has to be something upside down, back to front &/or not positioned right :rolleyes:
     
  12. tintop

    tintop Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    361
    Location:
    Canberra
    halfwit? if they missed this :):eek:

    Photo1292.jpg
     
    Chidori and TeeBee like this.
  13. syncro

    syncro Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    9,196
    Location:
    Southern Highlands
    That's what happens if you get an alignment at a tyre shop.

    "I'll set it up special for roundabouts".
     
  14. David H

    David H Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,142
    Location:
    newcastle
    And we've been there for you thru this Chidori. There must be something (simple) that's being missed?
    This response is about finding the "Datum (fixed point)" of your van? Safest start is the RHR wheel as the datum. Just measure fore /aft, left/ right to get where the chassis has gone wrong. For it has somewhere;). @cbus for measurements?
    Cheers
     
    Chidori likes this.
  15. David H

    David H Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,142
    Location:
    newcastle
    Chidori ....do you own a skateboard?
    Cheers
     
  16. Chidori

    Chidori Active Member

    Messages:
    918
    Location:
    Fitzroy, VIC
    The shop called and their inspection revealed three things -
    A. Everything is really tight because it's all the parts are new - no slop found.
    B. Wheel alignment is pretty much as @tintop posted above - completely out. Seems to think a 'proper' alignment will fix 99% of the issues.
    C. My tyres were made in 2006. Whoops.

    I'm going to send him through the bentley specs for the van tonight and he's going to adjust them tomorrow.
    Hunt is on for some replacement tyres. Would like some lower profile like Cbus mentions above - but the van is already pretty low - but just high enough not to cause any clearance issues.
     
    David H likes this.
  17. cbus

    cbus Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    11,428
    Location:
    sunshine coast
    Expect good things from a proper alignment ;)

    Height change isn't much from tyre OD changes as you should retain same OD to limit speedo and rev. Speed changes.
    Stock 650-653.
    Suggest stay within 643-658mm

    Lower profiles come from upsizing rim diamer and corresponding lower profile tyre to maintain OD.
    Some play in wider/ lower profile combo.

    A good alignment and shocks with good stockish tyres can be stable.

    Assume still 14" steel wheels?
    Interested in bigger wheels ?

    How much van lowered?
    Dropped spindles or beam adjusters ?
     
  18. Chidori

    Chidori Active Member

    Messages:
    918
    Location:
    Fitzroy, VIC
    Still on stock wheels... not really interested on getting bigger wheels. I've got plenty of other things to spend my money on. :)
    Lowered with beam adjusters - bump stops removed. Ride is fine, but with lots of up and down travel if you hit a decent bump in the road.
    Couldn't tell you how much it's lowered. Enough to notice it's lower, but not stupid low. It's actually at it's highest setting on it's adjusters. Could go much lower.

    You can see a photo here:
    https://www.instagram.com/p/Be5Hv4tgDKJ/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

    Does a wider tyre = more stability?
     
  19. Barry

    Barry Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,271
    Location:
    Abbotsford NSW
    If your “porpoise-ing” then your shocks are shot

    Had this on mine a while ago and all “bounce” disappeared after the Bilstein went on
     
    syncro likes this.
  20. Chidori

    Chidori Active Member

    Messages:
    918
    Location:
    Fitzroy, VIC
    It's been lowered with no bump stops so this is expected.
    Shocks are as good as new. They could be slightly firmer, but I'm happy with them.
     

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