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How to run in a new TIV engine

Discussion in 'Engine & Transmission' started by Dingostrategy, Feb 20, 2009.

  1. Dingostrategy

    Dingostrategy Active Member

    Messages:
    4,322
    Location:
    SW Vic ++
    Hi Folks,

    I have a new engine, and while I'll obviously take advice from the engine builder, I was surprised there was not a sticky or even a thread (not that I found anyway) about how to run in a new VW engine. Specifically a TIV 'pancake'.

    I have also done some web searches and there is nothing specific that I can see. But if you know otherwise, here's the thread!

    I don't know why a Kombi different would be any different to any other engine of about that age, but I'd like to know. The early advice I have is that speeds need to be mixed for the first 1000 or so, 60-80 for the first 500, then 80-110+ for the second. Sounds like a lovely drive in the country to me. Also, in VWs, tappets (should only be a check, but adjust if required) after 500, 1000, 2000 then 5000 and every 5000 thereafter (or more). Oil and filters after the first 2000 in a new engine. Obviously this depends if any running in is done on the stand, which in my case was what happened.

    This is not my engine builder's advice - which as yet I don't have. But asking around led to this. Comments, corrections, more info, links?

    Thanks in advance. :)
     
  2. dan_b

    dan_b Member

    Messages:
    570
    Location:
    mackay-
    iv always taken them for a run and not let them stay at the same rpm.this will lead it to bein lazy and you will have oil buring issue's from then.
    find some hills and let it work away,then some hiway speeds.
    it also depends on how it will be driven from day 1, nana it around, or let it rev and listen to it-i would perfer this option.
    i would check them again after it has got warm, maybe 15min-once it cooled down then after the 1st 1000km, then it should be oky untill the 5000km mark.

    are you using a running in oil?
    if you are change it after 1000km,with a new filter, and the oil you will be running-20/50 maybe even 15/40.
    then just change it at the normal 5000km
    and it should be okay from there.
    saying that oil and filter are cheap so you could even do it twice before the 5000km mark

    thats my 10cents,
     
  3. KahunaKombi

    KahunaKombi Super Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    18,660
    Location:
    Bracken Ridge, Qld
    Opinions vary and when I had to do the heads/valves and rings in mine late last year asked about tappets and someone said @ 500 someone at 750 and someone 500 then 1000 then every 5000 ??? Confused as I was. Done them at 500 adn still sounds ok so leaving until they get noisy or 5000.

    As for speed/revs - it is best to vary and highway kruizing is best 80/110 kph but hills also good for rev range so rings bed down nicely. You should notice a gradual power increase as everything settles while the first 5000k's are clocked up :) My runs have been 50 klms stints hour or so break (while mowing a vacant block) then return and each run seems to be better thant he last or I'm just happy to be on the highway :)
     
  4. Run it in using varying speeds and RPM but not revving it right out to redline obviously. A good mix of freeway and general suburb driving is good combined with undulating road conditions(hills).

    Drop oil and filter at 1000km and reset valve clearances. Also check for oil leaks, throw a spanner over manifolds, carbs and exhaust system.

    5000km doesn't hurt to retention heads especially if they are brand spankers. Drop rocker gear off and remove manifolds and lift tinware up to get to top head bolts. you can do it in the car just a lil fiddly. Throw a spanner over case bolts, bell housing bolts and engine mounts for peace of mind if you want to. Once you've done that then it prolly wouldn't hurt to get it on a dyno and get your mixtures, timing etc set.

    Then your off for many happy Km's of Kombi driving pleasure.....
     
  5. HunchyHillBilly

    HunchyHillBilly Member

    Messages:
    48
    Location:
    Hunchy, Queensland
  6. ttmck

    ttmck Super Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    2,733
    Location:
    Hallett Cove STH AUS
    i have some where spoken about this , but i cant find it
    the intial start is the most critical . basic timing and carb adjustment need to be done static timing etc without starting the engine never let it idle untill it is at operating temp 1000 rpm to 2000 rpm constantly varied with out driving
    once at operating temp , straight out on the road and accelerate thru the gears and once in top gear from 40 km to
    65 km / hr 10 times wide open throttle keep doing this as i said 10 times at least then its straight into a normal driving avoiding lugging up hills in top gear avoid also high speeds , it really gets down to driving sensible for the first 500 km .
    oil change at 500km then again at 1000 k
    tappets set at 1000 k again
    oil 30 grade no additives for intial fill and use till 1000k then a 20w 50 oil
     
  7. Dingostrategy

    Dingostrategy Active Member

    Messages:
    4,322
    Location:
    SW Vic ++
    Brilliant advice all. It's also nice that more or less everyone agrees. I am sure a few hundred either side is not going to matter all that much.

    I didn't know about that critical stuff during first starts. In fact I'm pretty sure the builder does a fair bit on the bench, but of course I need to clarify that. It's being started and moved around now, which is pretty good to know.

    I'm nervous about me, spanners and a brand spankin new donk for which I paid $x500! But the time to start seriously learning passed long ago. This will strongarm me into figuring out the basics of spanner operation and becoming at one with the machine.

    One month to go.

    Soon enough it'll be driven to the roadworthy guy!

    Like ttmck I also looked pretty hard - I figured it had to be in here somewhere.

    Can I propose a Mod copies the advice responses, deletes the original question and calls this a sticky? It's rude to ask for a sticky I guess but it seems to me this is good advice and relevant to many.
     
  8. kombi rescue

    kombi rescue New Member

    Messages:
    367
    Location:
    sydney
    the only parts that run in ..is the cam lobes and lifters .....piston rings.
     
  9. 66 deluxe

    66 deluxe New Member

    Messages:
    291
    Location:
    North Brisbane
    This is my method, firstly double check everything is in place ESPECIALLY the vacuum boots that connect to the inlet manifolds that assist the brake servo. Then i set timing via a static light, i rotate the engine till i have it 8 degrees BTDC, then i connect the static light to the neg. side of coil, then rotate dizzy till light just comes on, tighten dizzy clamp, then with plugs removed, i will crank engine over till oil light goes out this tells me that oil pressure is sufficient and engine ready to start, then install spark plugs make sure correct gap is set on each plug, i use an antisieze on the threads, (i personally have been using silver goop, its an aviation product that we use on gas turbine engines that i build in my full time job, we use a little on the igniter plugs that are found in the combustion chamber and these see tempretures well higher than a a piston engine ever will) i install and torque the spark plugs to the corect torque found in VW manual. Once i have done this i then check everything again, then i crank the engine over if the engine doesn't fire straight away i stop cranking and investigate, when/if any problems are found, i remedy then crank again, when it starts i take RPM straight to 2-2500rpm and hold it here for 20 minutes not letting it drop below 2000 RPM, and 20 minutes is a long time when ten minutes has passed you could swear that it was 20. While this running in is happening i diligently listen for any abnormal noises, and have a friend checking for leaks, after the 20 minutes i switch off the engine and let it cool, for a couple of hours so it gets cold again, so i can recheck the valve clearance. Once checks are complete i will then take for a dirive to check that engine is accelerating without hesitation. When driving i will go up and down hills to put a load on engine to help bed the rings in, i even get on the highway and do over 100 kph, the rings like rpm to bed in, i try not to baby the engine at all. I will accelerate in 3rd to high rpm then change to 4th. Once i am happy i will then drain the running in oil and add the normal operating oil and check the oil that has been changed for any forieng debris if found if any is found i will actually tear down the engine to investigate, so far so good with my engines. The oil that i prefer to use is Castrol EDGE 20w-50 this has an API SG/CD rating this is an excellent oil and well suited to our aircooled engines, try not to use an oil with an API rating higher than SG, why cause SG has the correct PPM of zinc and phosphorous levels required for our flat tappet valve train, higher API ratings are not good for our engines, as for running in oil i have found Penrite running in oil to be the best, it's an API SG oil with no friction modifiers, low detergent oil that is neccesary for running an engine in. I'm sure i might have missed something but this is my way and have found it to work great everytime.

    Damo.
     
  10. kommodius

    kommodius Active Member

    Great advice guys.

    Ray & da Boyz
     
  11. VolksBartz

    VolksBartz Member

    Messages:
    145
    Location:
    Newcastle/Sydney
    Just got my engine done and Boris from Vintage VW says about the same except he wants only lower speeds for first 600-800 clicks, more important didnt wan tme driving to Newcastle on the freeway before around the 1000 mark
     
  12. farquire

    farquire Member

    Messages:
    572
    Location:
    newport sydney
  13. 66 deluxe

    66 deluxe New Member

    Messages:
    291
    Location:
    North Brisbane
    I no longer use Castrol or penrite oils for running in or normal use, i have 10 cases of Bradd Penn oil under my bench this IS the best oil you can get, for our engines, it has everything you need in an oil. I am a distributor for this oil for those in the brisbane area, people outside this area can still get through me but the national distibutor is motor sport connection in sydney, i am a listed distributor for them. This is the oil Jake Raby swears by, i will be working for mr Raby next month throughout July and early August, mainly concentrating on type 4 engiens especially bus but also for type 4 into type 1 applications. I will also be trained in the porsche boxster/996 M96 engines.

    Damo.

    Aircooled Motorworks.
     
  14. VolksVair

    VolksVair New Member

    Messages:
    414
    Location:
    Geelong VIC
    Everyone who has commented on the first 20 minutes of an engines life as the most critical are right on the money!!! cam lobes & lifters in particular. As for running in, my main guidlines are just two. No 1, dont over rev it. No 2, Dont labor it !! I have always used Penrite motor oils since the early eighties. cheers Frank
     
  15. 1500king

    1500king Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,532
    Location:
    Adelaide, SA
    What do you mean??? Labour it??? ...good mineral oil with cam lube will cover it..then work the old girl to bed the rings in... You guys think too much...
     
  16. VolksVair

    VolksVair New Member

    Messages:
    414
    Location:
    Geelong VIC
    Labour as in dont climb hills in top gear sorry for late reply, only spotted this today
     

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