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Rocket fuel???

Discussion in 'Engine & Transmission' started by BrissyGeorge, Jul 11, 2015.

  1. BrissyGeorge

    BrissyGeorge Active Member

    Messages:
    318
    Location:
    Brisbane
    Shell 95 is my fuel of choice - nothing scientific to back this up - just a victim of marketing I guess - but anyway it has worked on me and have used it on all our cars for years. I have scoffed at fuel sold at 7&11 as being "no brand".

    Anyway, to cut to the chase, last week I got caught and wasn`t going to play Russian Roulette with the fuel guage to get to my favourite Shell servo and therefore, under sufferance, called into the next servo which happened to be a 7 & 11.

    Their pumps were branded MOBIL and their choice was 10% ethanol NO WAY, 91 - better but I normally use 95, OR 99. I took the 99 option although it was pricy.

    Now I don`t know whether its my imagination, or my brain trying to justify the cost, but Mr K seems to be going better - more zip - bit more torque.

    Anyone else had a similar experience or is it my imagination
     
  2. Dubman

    Dubman Well-Known Member

    This is always a topic of mixed response.
    I always ran 98 (BP Ultimate) (Mobil Supreme+ 98) in my bus, now whether due to how the car was tuned or I visiting a bad servos but when I ran Shell or Caltex's versions of 98 my mpg and performance seemed to change. I used to run a mileage app on my phone to monitor each fill up and always showed better performance form BP & 711 (Mobil Fuel is also what Costco use).
    Even my old Subaru used to ping and rattle on Shell Optimax/Vpower but ran smoother on the BP Ultimate or 711/Mobil stuff, the wife's newer Forester doesn't seem as fussy though she runs Shell all the time usually the 95 but 98 when price is right.
    We refuse to use the Ethanol stuff regardless of the supposed benifits to the economy, it is shit fuel (it burns quicker so saving are minimal if at all) and here at work we only recommend it to those that have cars built specifically for it, which in the brands we sell is only basically the v8 commodore Blah.

    This is my personal experience and as I said above you'll get mixed responses.

    Go with what works best if you have an Android phone check out this app good what to track the differences and see how your cars performing https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.evancharlton.mileage
     
  3. Marlyn

    Marlyn Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    938
    Location:
    Eleebana / Newcastle
    Off topic but with no scientific logic I reckon my bus goes better with a full tank than say half or less ?
    Rational thought would say more fuel more weight to carry ?
    Either way it's about the drive and the smile
     
  4. chris taylor

    chris taylor Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,068
    Location:
    adelaide sth aust
    I changed over to (95oct) when I had my engine rebuilt and would not go back to 91 ever. do not tend to see any marked difference between 95 rated and 98 but will use 98 when not able to get 95 as can sometimes happen in country towns. The difference in price is about the cost of a cuppacino or two per week so well worth it ,
    There is some talk around the traps that 91 oct does contain E10 in all brands but im not sure that it can be verified . Talking in old terms I always get around the 22mpg mark regardless of fuel used, but in the end it comes down to what is best for the engine, as in I wont use cheap oil so why would I want to use a lower grade fuel, That's my thoughts any rate .;) Definitely about the drive, then comes the smile:D:D:D
     
  5. wirrah

    wirrah Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,699
    Location:
    Lower Hunter, NSW
    In NSW at least 91 is freely available sans ethanol. The usual availability is 98, 95, 91 and E10. Previous legislation mandated E10 for all 91 fuels however this was repealed.
     
  6. chris taylor

    chris taylor Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,068
    Location:
    adelaide sth aust
    ok mate that clears up that query, tks
     
  7. oldman

    oldman Super Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    10,983
    Location:
    Avalon Beach NSW
    I run BP 98.
    I've tried all other options & I reckon the bus is happiest with that……..
    Maybe I'm dillusional but the figures, (milage vs consumption), prove that this is the right choice for my engine/gearbox/tune setup.
    Each to their own & I know there are folks that are equally as happy running 91 RON.
    Play around with different fuels & vary your runs between freeway & city….you'll soon find what's best for your bus.
    Cheers,
    Mark
     
  8. chris taylor

    chris taylor Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,068
    Location:
    adelaide sth aust
    Agreed Mark , 95 is what I use at the moment, I do notice a significant power boost with the higher oct but do you see any difference in the running temperature between 91 and 95 or 98 I have been told that it should run marginally cooler but only having an oil cooler gauge It is a bit hard to judge. Your thoughts.
     
  9. syncro

    syncro Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    10,368
    Location:
    Southern Highlands
    Heads run cooler not engine.
     
  10. oldman

    oldman Super Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    10,983
    Location:
    Avalon Beach NSW
    Hey Chris, I'm also running an additional external oil cooler. The fan kicks in at 90 deg. however it really only cuts in during summer, & rarely at that.
    Everyday oil temps rarely get over 85, including hill climbs & long runs etc.
    I figure if the engine has to work harder, it's going to heat up faster….( both heads & oil )…..
    This is where a premium, correctly spec. oil is critical to cooler running temps too.
    Gotta remember that these buses are as much oil-cooled as air cooled too.
    I was out at my mechs. the other day & there was a bus with a cooked engine…..direct result from using cheap, incorrect spec. oil.
    I don't think one thing makes too much of a difference, oil aside, however a well balanced unit with all the "right bits", correctly maintained, is best.
    Cheers,
    Mark
     
  11. chris taylor

    chris taylor Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,068
    Location:
    adelaide sth aust
    Under normal running conditions what would be the safe running temperature of the engine or oil or both {Summer time }
     
  12. oldman

    oldman Super Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    10,983
    Location:
    Avalon Beach NSW
    I'm not sure Chris…..I'm no mech. but I think it'll depend on:
    1. the location the vehicle is driven in….Qld. vs Tas. for example
    2. the condition of the engine…..that means all components in place, in good condition & tuned properly
    3. having engine compartment seals complete…….foam seal between top & bottom half & complete seal around rear engine hatch
    4. all tinware complete & without holes or missing block-outs

    I'm sure someone can/will provide an answer for you, however I feel there are a lot of variables to consider….
    Cheers,
    Mark
     
  13. chris taylor

    chris taylor Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,068
    Location:
    adelaide sth aust
    Mark, tks, I have seen these external oil coolers hanging down under the sump but I wasn't aware they were fan cooled , if yours is that type. As near as I can see, {just had a look at the oil gauge} mine ,on a run, runs at around 95 to 105, when I am doing 90 kph, that's on a warm to hot day, 30 to 38 cel. have not had any problems at that temp but is always good to know the limits of these things, how much did the external cooler cost you and where did you get it
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2015
  14. syncro

    syncro Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    10,368
    Location:
    Southern Highlands
    I used to keep my T2 (1800) under 100C. It usually run around 70-80 except on really hot days. When it got to 90C I would take it easy. This was a stock engine in good condition and I often sat over 110kmh for long periods.
     
  15. cbus

    cbus Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    13,570
    Location:
    sunshine coast
    those temps under those conditions without an aftermarket oil cooler .?
    you don't have a problem. [check calibration of gauge with spot checks off oil filter and sump plate under dipstick with a infra red spot thermometer after a HWY run and asap ]
    do a colour check of your plugs as well to ensure mix and temps are within range but I wouldn't expect issues.
    if all tinware/foam seal is in place , timing is correct, oil has over 1200 parts zinc , you run something close to a 20/50 then cant see any issues.

    if you suddenly get higher temps by 10c then find out why.
    sudden or consistent over 120 you need to find out why.
    130 you have an issue and do something immediately to drop temps or stop driving.

    ballpark.
     
  16. oldman

    oldman Super Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    10,983
    Location:
    Avalon Beach NSW
    Hey Chris, my ext. cooler is plumbed in, up under the sliding door sill, just forward of the step. ( the step is an extra on Campmobiles )
    The additional pipework means another 1.5 ltrs of oil, however the real benefit lies with the fan that kicks in via a thermo-sensor & draws air through the cooler.
    The setup is much like a small radiator/fan configuration….difference is that this one runs oil instead of water…..

    The ones you are referring to are the deep-sump bolt on kits. They allow additional oil but it's not fan-forced/cooled.
    Mike at CBB VW did mine….(from memory under $1000 )- all parts & labour included.
    Only quality parts used by a skilled mechanic…..could be more than most would pay but I've never had anything that Mike has done, let me down.;)
    You can check it out at TBS 2016 if you like.
    As Col. posted above, looking at your running temps. & driving conditions, you don't appear to have any abnormal readings…...
    Cheers,
    Mark
     
  17. chris taylor

    chris taylor Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,068
    Location:
    adelaide sth aust
    Good on you guys ,appreciate your comments, going on your imfo and experience I tend to agree that I do not have an issue. I never go over the ton though, always below, get to see more that way but apart from that will certainly look into some sort of extra cooling for it .On really hot days it has got up to 110deg after a long sustained run but has never gone over that. Thanks all.
    Regards Chris
     
  18. BrissyGeorge

    BrissyGeorge Active Member

    Messages:
    318
    Location:
    Brisbane
    Great example of thread drift - started out with a question re fuel and ended with a discussion about running temps and oil coolers:)
     
  19. cbus

    cbus Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    13,570
    Location:
    sunshine coast
    that never happens here:eek:
    fuels is a bit like oils. many variables
    I suspect results are more to do with the engine and state of tune than fuel types.
    higher octane wont give more power unless theres some mechanical reason such as upped compression or advanced timing.
    although better fuels should have improved ability to clean deposits and are formulated to include different blends of ingredients. some may initiate combustion easier over lesser fuels.
    I suspect results are from engines running badly [even tho not noticed] on the lesser quality fuel or less power from alcohol tampered fuels.
    same with temps. any improvement meant that the engine wasn't tuned for the previous fuel or has some underlying issues.

    but fuel/engine combo can make a big difference.
    my t3 with injection runs on 95/98 and LPG
    run it on 95 till tank at minimum, add 1/4 tank of 91. runs like a pig. so bad that it hardly gets up a slight hill going home. return immediately to servo and top another half tank of 98. comes good within a couple of km.
    have repeated this carefuly a few times with same results.
    haven't checked why.
    suspect it just has a hard time igniting the 91??? due to whatever conditions.
    don't suspect it has high compression and advance is conservative.
    doesn't ping. just runs as if tanks low and running out of fuel/bad electrical.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2015
  20. chris taylor

    chris taylor Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,068
    Location:
    adelaide sth aust
    I reckon that this is what this site is all about, throwing up a subject a about something your not to sure about and seeing where it goes, and along the way you might learn something . Sometimes I think my questions are a bit iffy but if one doesn't ask one doesn't find out.:(;):D
     

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