1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

77 bay steering and wander... Running out of options.....

Discussion in 'Bay Tech Clinic' started by Chidori, Aug 28, 2012.

  1. syncro

    syncro Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    9,316
    Location:
    Southern Highlands
    New tyres on the Subaru last week. While they were working on it they said that there could be a problem undoing one nut and could break a stud. (Subaru problem so they say)

    Take car home notice slime all over the wheels. Check wheels and see scratches and rash marks all over them. Previously they were scratch free.

    They said they put 36psi in them which is correct. Checked them the next day cold and there was 41psi.

    After driving 100kms I like to check the tension on the wheel nuts. Tension was close but noticed a wheel nut missing and a broken stud.

    I shouldn't have been so lazy and just driven to Sydney to buy tyres.
     
  2. cbus

    cbus Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    11,711
    Location:
    sunshine coast
    Time for a realignment of genetic pool.
    Open season on monkeys.:rolleyes:
     
    TeeBee, Chidori and syncro like this.
  3. Wayne murray

    Wayne murray Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,866
    Location:
    Seven hills
    The other thing tyre place like doing to Volkswagens is jack the rear of the car up by the engine:mad: Doesn't do the engine mounts any good.
     
    chris taylor and syncro like this.
  4. chris taylor

    chris taylor Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,893
    Location:
    adelaide sth aust
    Gave you a LIKE .thats for the post. But gave a big DISLIKE for any imbecile that would even think of doing that.
     
    Wayne murray likes this.
  5. Mellow Yellow 74

    Mellow Yellow 74 Active Member

    Messages:
    845
    Location:
    Sydney
    If they did anything the would only have checked toe and wouldn't have changes any thing if it was ok. Most tyre places don't have equipment or knowledge to check camber and caster so I wouldn't worry too much about that.
     
    chris taylor and cbus like this.
  6. cbus

    cbus Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    11,711
    Location:
    sunshine coast
    Yep.
    A case of no knowledge being helpful.
     
    Chidori and chris taylor like this.
  7. Chidori

    Chidori Active Member

    Messages:
    921
    Location:
    Fitzroy, VIC
    This is common practice on Classic Porsche 911's - raising the rear of the car by mounting the jack under the engine. Plenty of people on porsche forums swear by it. I refuse to jack any car up by it's engine - particularly a Porsche - where an engine rebuild comes in at around $20k.

    Problem is - I wouldn't trust them to know whether or not it is or isn't ok.

    Did you contact them to tell them what happened?

    My guys are still yet to contact me regarding the feedback I provided... How long should I give them before destroying their streak of 5 star ratings on google? :)
     
    David H likes this.
  8. cbus

    cbus Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    11,711
    Location:
    sunshine coast
    [QUOTE="Chidori, post:
    Did you contact them to tell them what happened?

    My guys are still yet to contact me regarding the feedback I provided... How long should I give them before destroying their streak of 5 star ratings on google? :)[/QUOTE]

    Don't expect feedback to be closely monitored.
    If you feel inclined ( and I would re how to treat a customers gearbox plus charging for wheel alignment when told not to touch it. Find out if touched.) A direct email is best.
    Gives them time to think before responding.

    If unsatisfactory response just state the facts on feedback.
     
  9. Chidori

    Chidori Active Member

    Messages:
    921
    Location:
    Fitzroy, VIC
    Don't expect feedback to be closely monitored.
    If you feel inclined ( and I would re how to treat a customers gearbox plus charging for wheel alignment when told not to touch it. Find out if touched.) A direct email is best.
    Gives them time to think before responding.

    If unsatisfactory response just state the facts on feedback.[/QUOTE]

    Yeh, sent them a direct mail via their website. They seem to be the sort of people that would care about negative feedback. I will wait and see.
     
    cbus likes this.
  10. TeeBee

    TeeBee Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    278
    Location:
    Outer East Melbourne
    Noooooo! :confused::confused::confused:
     
    Chidori likes this.
  11. syncro

    syncro Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    9,316
    Location:
    Southern Highlands
    Yes.

    New stud and nut ordered. Replaced today for $40. $22 labour (0.2 hours). Whether that was their fault or not I will never know. The weird thing is that the stud was broken where it would have been 5mm into the nut. I cannot understand how this could happen and would love to have taken it to a metallurgist for investigation if they had given me the parts.
     
    Chidori likes this.
  12. Chidori

    Chidori Active Member

    Messages:
    921
    Location:
    Fitzroy, VIC
    So, after trecking around town with the new tyres for a week or so - I can confirm that there was no noticeable improvement to handling.
    Infact, it actually doesn't feel like it's handling as well as it was with the old tyres - much more skittish.

    The suspension guy did suggest that I bring it back after the new tyres were fitted to double check that everything was still ok. Assuming that the muppets at the tyre store didn't touch the alignment as advised - the different sized tyres are really the only thing that has changed. Looks like it's a saturday morning adventure to the outer suburbs again for some alignment love.

    Also, the tyre people never got back to me about my feedback. I've noticed that even after adjusting my shift plate - it's REALLY difficult to get it into 2nd. Might have to have another go at adjusting it. Hopefully they didn't permanently wreck my gearbox!!
     
  13. cbus

    cbus Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    11,711
    Location:
    sunshine coast
    Is the skittishness the front tramlining or the rear moving around?

    Try 34f. 40r. Cold or at servo if its only a couple of km.

    Worth checking alignment and asking his opinion.
     
  14. chris taylor

    chris taylor Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,893
    Location:
    adelaide sth aust
    I have put my tyre pressures as such Rr 40 Frt 32 ,as col suggest {i think }soft in front gives better grip ,less wander , is now better than it has been in a long while:D, are you running Hancooks :( not my best choice of tyres ,:rolleyes: heavy vehicle needs solid tyres ,my choice is and always will be LTTs , ran Hancooks on a Chrysler VJ S/wag once They were the worst tyres i had ever had,took them back and threatened to go to consumer affairs if they did not exchange them for Dunlops , That was a long time ago,but once bitten twice shy.got them from a K Mart store .LESSON IS , if you want milk dont go to a hairdresser .
     
    David H likes this.
  15. Chidori

    Chidori Active Member

    Messages:
    921
    Location:
    Fitzroy, VIC
    The steering is still loose as it always has been. I never really expected an alignment to fix that or new tyres. But it was able to hold its like better before new tyres. Now it's following the gradient of the road a little more and heading towards the downward slope.
    I also notice there are times that the wheels feel like they suddenly turn in a direction of their own . I realised I have never properly checked the wheel bearings myself. Only ever went on a mechanics word. I mean I have wiggled them off the ground but didn't notice any noticeable play. I'll have a check with a dial gauge and check that they are in spec.
     
  16. cbus

    cbus Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    11,711
    Location:
    sunshine coast
    I expect that the alignment guy will have checked bearing adjustment ( only front adjustable, rears are not tapered bearings)

    Its a standard procedure of checking everything is not worn in suspension and tyre pressures correct before proceeding.
    Sometimes its necessary to do drops to check for chassis distortion.

    Sounds like the new tyres are gripping a bit more or the extra width adding to tramlining effect.
    Same for drift following camber.
    Pattern can also increase that as can lower pressure.

    Unfortunately they are the only suitably rated tyres I could find that i would try other than Lt.
    From running passenger tyres on bigger rims and previously passenger on 14" when they were available I know that Lt are not necessary as long as you have the rating thus ability to use sufficient pressures.

    Try the higher pressures I suggested above.
    I expect a slight improvement from that.

    My guess is aligner may have your front toe at spec which is 0-3 mm in .
    An extra mm may help with extra width but its usualy only when 215 or more wide then 4 mm on some cars?

    Drifting to left is better than Rt and shows a fairly centered setup.
    To compensate he may adjust camber or caster slightly.

    Grab before and after numbers this time.
    Not second guessing him but interested to see what he finds works for your van.
    Trust his opinion as he has worked on the van and produced improvement's
     
    chris taylor likes this.
  17. Chidori

    Chidori Active Member

    Messages:
    921
    Location:
    Fitzroy, VIC
    Looks like I have found the source of the sloppy steering! Freakin' wheel bearings!
    I've had probably 4 mechanics check them over the years. No problem they say.
    I've even checked them twice myself - jacked the car - gave the wheels a wiggle from side to side, up and down, etc. No noticeable play.
    Today I thought Id have another look using the dial indicator to measure if there was any play. Turns out there was more play than you could see with the naked eye.
    So, I pulled out the front bearings and cleaned them up. The grease was super old. Bearings looked ok. Re-packed them and tightened them up a little more tight than when I removed them.

    Took the bus for a 30 min drive and the difference was really obvious! Still not perfect, but the slop in the steering is SO much better!
    The steering wheel now strongly returns to the centre when turning. It still feels as if it's tighter when turning to the left rather than the right. My money is on one of the inner bearings being toast or the races being excessively worn.

    I'll pick myself up a set of bearings, seals and races and see how much better this can get - but I'm pretty happy that after everything - this looks like it was the missing link!

    Just re-affirms my decision years ago - to do everything myself and never to rely on so-called professionals!
     
    TeeBee, Wayne murray, saabman and 2 others like this.
  18. Barry

    Barry Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,603
    Location:
    Abbotsford NSW
    Great result !!
     
    Chidori likes this.
  19. chris taylor

    chris taylor Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,893
    Location:
    adelaide sth aust
    Kombis are funny things aint they, gotta love em though.
    Were the bearings a tight fit on the shaft ??????
    Glad to see you MAY have found the source of yr problem, fingers xd
     
    Chidori likes this.
  20. chris taylor

    chris taylor Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,893
    Location:
    adelaide sth aust
    Chidori,
    there is always some good that comes out of the bad ,
    If someone else has a similar prob,that could be the first place to start, then work their way from there.
    you might also consider adding your findings into the Bay Tech Clinic as this would normally be the first place someone will look for answers, just a thought .
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2019
    TeeBee and Chidori like this.

Share This Page