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IRS, Indian automotive vs creative

Discussion in 'Splitty Tech Clinic' started by Squidy, Aug 6, 2012.

  1. Squidy

    Squidy Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,756
    Location:
    Eumundi
    Just been researching a little on replacing reduction hubs so I can get a few more mph, anyone got any advice or comments on using either of the two set ups, Indian vs creative. Laymens terms and a brief overview of what is needed to be done would be good , due to my lack of skills :rolleyes: thank you
     
  2. oldman

    oldman Super Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    10,990
    Location:
    Avalon Beach NSW
    Hey Steve, pm sent. Cheers, Mark
     
  3. Roo

    Roo Active Member

    Messages:
    345
    Location:
    Riverina
    Hi Mark. I would be interested in same info if that's ok? Gathering as much info as I can in preparation!
     
  4. Kombi Dad

    Kombi Dad Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,457
    Location:
    Bungendore, NSW
  5. 77/kombi/surfer

    77/kombi/surfer Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,159
    Location:
    Budgewoi N.S.W. AUSTRALIA
    hey squidy,
    if you want your ride low an the easiest to install, then the indian setup is the go.
    You can do the wheel alignment adjustment at a tyre seller like tyre power.
    You dont have to cut out the horns an is a bolt in setup, an can always go back to stock setup.
    Just need to have a set of trailing arms an spring plates to exchange over.Cost around $1000.

    http://www.kruizinwagon.com.au/view_products.asp?pxa=ve&id=28

    You can see what has to be done for creative irs on there website an what has to be cut out as on my 62pmg resto on here.
    Basically cut the gearbox horns out an weld in the creative setup, you have to be 100% correct on your setup or youll have bad wheel alignment an its not a nice thing to grind back an do again if wrong.
    The ride will be more to stock height an less camber on the rear wheels.cost around the same $1000
    http://www.creative-engineering.com...tegory_id=143&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=26
    hope this helps you out an im sure theres others who can give you there insight to there setups,
    cheers chuckster
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2012
  6. oldman

    oldman Super Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    10,990
    Location:
    Avalon Beach NSW
    hey Roo, pm sent. Cheers, mark
     
  7. Squidy

    Squidy Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,756
    Location:
    Eumundi
    Cheers Chuck
    Guess you have to lower the front if you go for the Indian set up ? As I'm a mechanical doofus, what's the best way to do front ? Read that this set up lowers the bus by about 3.5 , does it make a lot of difference to handling ?
     
  8. Squidy

    Squidy Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,756
    Location:
    Eumundi
    Cheers mate, will look into it. Think I'm going to have to sell one of my toys to finance what I want to get done :(
     
  9. Ian 68

    Ian 68 New Member

    Messages:
    212
    Location:
    Qld
    No matter what way you go, Indian / creative or weld in as Steve Muller does you will have to lower the front by the same amount to even out the ride.

    If you have a stock split beam you can flip the spindles and hey presto the drop is about the same as your IRS rear end, most people also add beam adjusters to balance / fine tune ride height.

    If you go with ball joint from a 68 early 69 bay beam you will have to fit adjusters and you will have to narrow the beam, although the early beam will bolt straight in to a split the ride height will require adjusters and your track will be wider than a stock split beam, hence why nearly all split lowered beams are narrowed. An excellent bloke to speak to is Bernie at Munster Garage in WA, he's a very respected builder of beams and he also flips spindles etc.

    My choice was to use an Indian kit as I have a early Yoot and did not want to cut it at all.

    You also have the option to straight axle your rear end, this will take the bus down real low and can be easier to source parts such as a good gearbox !

    Consider your options and way up all the costs, decide how low you want to, decide if original stud pattern is important to you, are you capable to weld in parts ? , can you do any thing yourself ? lots and lots of choices and decisions to make.

    It's all been done before so you will find lots of info and help out there, my suggestion would be to take a look on DSK and have a read up.

    Best

    Ian
     
  10. Squidy

    Squidy Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,756
    Location:
    Eumundi
    Thanks Ian
    At the moment I'm thinking I don't want to cut the bus and like the idea of returning to reduction hubs if needed. Also im not after a low bus, was just looking to get a few more mph. As I have low compression in one cylinder the donk will need work in the future so will be putting something with a bit more go about it in anyway, thought by removing reduction hubs this would add to performance and help with the ride quality.
    I'm mechanically useless so I would need someone else to do the work for me.
    Cheers, Steve
     
  11. Ian 68

    Ian 68 New Member

    Messages:
    212
    Location:
    Qld
    You will feel a huge difference in ride without redux hubs ! If your not going to cut the bus and dont want to go really low then I'd say go Indian as it's easily reversible as it's bolt in.

    I'm no expert at all but with the help of a mate, some sound advise and a great set of instructions from Kimm at Indian it is easy to do.

    Once you have made your mind up, start chasing and sourcing parts. Remember to factor in the cost of doing a front end as well, you can just lower the rear !

    Take your time, talk to lots of people...Steve at Kombi rescue, Kimm at Indian, Bernie at Munster garage, all great guys to deal with and extremely helpful and giving of their time.

    Recommend you ask this question on DSK, you'll get a whole lot of good info there mate, some very very switched on Ladies and Gents over there ( as I'm sure there are here ) but as it's a forum mainly for the split you'll find the answers a lot easier to come by IMO.
     
  12. Squidy

    Squidy Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,756
    Location:
    Eumundi
    Thanks Ian, I'm on DSK and will put up there also
     
  13. Menangler

    Menangler Member

    Messages:
    198
    Location:
    NSW South Coast
    You don't have to lower the front if you set your IRS kit at stock height, that's what I did, I used an Indian bolt on kit and my bus still looks stock, rides so much better and no reduction box noise anymore.
    One thing I did use was some Beetle Gearbox to Kombi CV drive flanges, so I can run 4 Kombi CV's.
     
  14. Kombi Dad

    Kombi Dad Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,457
    Location:
    Bungendore, NSW
    We also stayed at stock height also on my conversion of the SC.

    Ian
     
  15. Squidy

    Squidy Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,756
    Location:
    Eumundi
    So you didn't touch the front end set up ?
     
  16. Kombi Dad

    Kombi Dad Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,457
    Location:
    Bungendore, NSW
    That's correct. We did not touch the front end.
     
  17. Ian 68

    Ian 68 New Member

    Messages:
    212
    Location:
    Qld
    Sorry about the info regarding lowering the front, I just assumed you were also wanting to get it down a bit closer to the ground as well.

    The guys are right, you can of course leave the front end as stock, but if you go IRS " for more MPH " I'd be thinking of up grading the brakes ..
     
  18. gusfallis

    gusfallis Member

    Messages:
    112
    Location:
    Newcastle
    Squidy, as someone mentioned early you can just put in a stright axle conversion to get rid of the reduction gearboxes.
    Krackers has had one of these in his lifetime and it gives a good stance. Albeit mine isn't perfect as it keeps destroying wheel bearings on me.
     
  19. KombiMadness

    KombiMadness Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,701
    Location:
    Sunshine Coast
    SA is also a lot cheaper than IRS and Bernie from Munster in WA does a great kit for a very reasonable price. He is an engineer. But you will also need to get your spindles flipped up front (this gives you the same or close to same geometry for steering/suspension) so that the bus is level. About a 3 1/2 " drop all round.....
     
  20. Squidy

    Squidy Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,756
    Location:
    Eumundi
    Still doing my research and spoke to a couple of people just wonder what folk think ??
    " Just the rear end, IRS and Gearbox fitted would be about $6000 and a bit, Roughly, but I would really need to see the bus."

    Ball joint beam, disc brake front end, drum rear, all new brakes, ball joints hoses, pipes, steering suspension and as much new as possible with a transmission which would be reconditioned, all fitted with your motor back in place, and both front and rear adjustable is going to be around $15K, just to give you an idea.

    This is for somebody doing all the work for me, people think costs are accurate ???
     

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